How to configure smart hubs for multiple pixelnet dongles?

[Steve Gase]

Still digging through all of the videos and wading through old discussions, but I'm thinking that the answer is likely easily available if I just ask...

I have 3 pixelnet dongles.  Each has a different COMx port.  Each dongle is connect to a single combiner using jacks #1, #2, and #3 (...with #4 empty).

The single output cable from the combiner comes into the Pixelnet Input jack of active-hub #1.  From hub #1 I have a cable connected from the first Pixelnet Output jack to hub #2, and another cable connecting hub #1 from the second Pixelnet Output jack to hub #3.  (in other words, I did not daisy chain the 3 hubs, but used a star configuration to connect hub #1 directly to #2 and also to #3.  (it shouldn't make much of a difference I suspect, but I was attempting to reduce the hop count)

What I am unclear on:

For hub #1, what should the PixelNet jumper be set to?  what should the Universe jumper be set to?  What about the DMX Universe?

Same questions for hubs #2 and #3...

For hub #2, what should the PixelNet jumper be set to?  what should the Universe jumper be set to?  What about the DMX Universe?
For hub #3, what should the PixelNet jumper be set to?  what should the Universe jumper be set to?  What about the DMX Universe?


From the software side, I believe that I set up multiple controllers, each reusing the range from 1 to 4096.  However I associate each controller with a Zone that in turn associates that controller to a specific COMx port, and the dongle that goes to a particular active hub.

If I did not use the combiner, I would expect each hub to use jumpers 1, and 1 and 1.  So, when using a combiner I think I am looking just for the selector on the hub that chooses which dongle wire pair should be be used on THIS hub.. 

The other think I am trying to do is reserve the first 99 channels for DMX usage.  I want to connect some DMX elements to the DMX Output jack.  If I start my SSCs at Pixelnet channel 100, and I have DMX devices with channels under 100, I would think it would all work.  If I am using that range... I assume that DMX Universe should be set to jumper 1... right?

Thanks for the information!!
I want to be able to use DMX on one or more of the

[rm357]

The dongle outputs on pair 1, the combiner moves the signal to another pair dependin on which port you plug the dongle into. The ss hub outputs all 4 pairs. Set both pixnet jumpers to match the port# on the combiner of the dongle you want to control that hub. The dmx will always be in the same pixnet universe as the hub it is on.

Rm

Ps-i don'thave a combiner handy, so i don't know if there are numbers on the ports or not. You may have todo trial and error to figure out which port is which...

[Steve Gase]

I'm wishing that the wiki "manual" was a little bit more of a user manual and not just assembly instructions.

I wish the behavior and usage was described in one spot -- and in this case I wish to see the jumper purpose/behavior to be described.

Here is what I think happens:

Pixelnet jumper:  select the dongle output that should be presented on this active hub.  Selecting pixelnet jumper #1 will select the input pair #1, etc.

DMX universe jumper:  select which bank of 512 addresses out of the 4096 pixelnet addresses found on this board will be presented through the DMX Output connector.

Example:  out of the 16384 channels provided with 4 pairs coming into a Combiner...  we wish to have DMX channels 10753-11264 provided by the DMX output on the hub.  This means that we are in the 3rd 4096 channel range and the pixelnet jumper should be set to 3.  and we are in the 5th 512 channel block within that range... so set the DMX universe to 5.    IS THAT ALL CORRECT?   (yes that has a "side effect" of bringing pixelnet channels 8193-12288 to the 16 smart string output jacks...)

But what about the Universe jumpers?  what is their purpose?  when should they be changed from the default '1'?

[rdebolt]

I am not using any DMX with my hubs so not sure about that, but for pixelnet you want to match you pixelnet jumper with your universe jumper. So dongle 1 plugged into #1 combiner=Hub Pixelnet 1, Universe 1, Dongle 2 plugged into Combiner 2 with Hub 2 Jumper on Pixelnet 2 and Universe 2. All the combiner does is change the wire pairs in the cat 5 cable that the data is transmitted on. Yes the combiners are marked 1-4 input. The jumpers on the hubs tell the hub which Cat 5 wire pairs to read 1,2,3 or 4.

[jeffcoast]

I'm wishing that the wiki "manual" was a little bit more of a user manual and not just assembly instructions.

I wish the behavior and usage was described in one spot -- and in this case I wish to see the jumper purpose/behavior to be described.

Here is what I think happens:

Pixelnet jumper:  select the dongle output that should be presented on this active hub.  Selecting pixelnet jumper #1 will select the input pair #1, etc.

DMX universe jumper:  select which bank of 512 addresses out of the 4096 pixelnet addresses found on this board will be presented through the DMX Output connector.

Example:  out of the 16384 channels provided with 4 pairs coming into a Combiner...  we wish to have DMX channels 10753-11264 provided by the DMX output on the hub.  This means that we are in the 3rd 4096 channel range and the pixelnet jumper should be set to 3.  and we are in the 5th 512 channel block within that range... so set the DMX universe to 5.    IS THAT ALL CORRECT?   (yes that has a "side effect" of bringing pixelnet channels 8193-12288 to the 16 smart string output jacks...)

But what about the Universe jumpers?  what is their purpose?  when should they be changed from the default '1'?

I asked the same question, and actually the way the pcb is printed is confusing, there aren't 2 different things there, but just one and both jumpers need to be on the same header. It isn't "pixelnet" and "universe", but is "Pixelnet Universe" for both sets of numbers. So if the first header is on 2, the second set also needs to be on 2 to complete the circuit.

I agree this stuff is confusing. I thought I had everything set right, but went and plugged everything in and had my second universe channels start at 4097, and got only blue out of it, had to change to 4098 to get the red.

[Steve Gase]

In the PixeNetExample.pdf document (found in the Wiki) RJ says...

If you need more channels than this you add a dongle and a hub. You get the next 4096 channels This dongle plugin in the software gets setup with the channels 4097 - 8192 in the software.

Now it has 4096 channels they are numbered ch # 4097 - 8192 in the software.

It is really that simple.

I hope this helps someone.

RJ

This is confusing me, and maybe it is a problem with how a specific piece of software does the mapping, or there is some EtherDongle stuff being injected into the conversation.

But, I thought from the LSP side of things there are up to 4 separate Pixelnet connections... each one having its own COMx port to associate itself with a specific pixelnet dongle.  You would NOT assign in the software channels above 4096, instead the SSCs would be created and associated with separate pixelnet dongles and each would have its own address range within 1-4096.

It is my understanding that SOFTWARE does not know anything about a combiner, nor the pins uses to select a pixelnet wire pair.  SOFTWARE treats these as separate Zones/Universes.  I expected that whether I decide to run 4 dongles and hubs as 4 discrete setups, or I decide to use a combiner and jumpers -- everything from software and channel config behaves the same.  Right??

Even at the SSC and Hub level... the hub does not do anything with channels above 4096 -- though it could theoretically do a mod 4096 on all channel numbers.

I don't know if I should assign 4097+ channel numbers in the SSC configuration, and/or use 4097+ channel numbers when I define my controllers in LSP.

...I guess as I read though this again, maybe I am overthinking this and I should take the literal meaning of RJ's words.  Looking for confirmation from someone using more than one active hub!!

[Steve Gase]

I am not using any DMX with my hubs so not sure about that, but for pixelnet you want to match you pixelnet jumper with your universe jumper. So dongle 1 plugged into #1 combiner=Hub Pixelnet 1, Universe 1, Dongle 2 plugged into Combiner 2 with Hub 2 Jumper on Pixelnet 2 and Universe 2. All the combiner does is change the wire pairs in the cat 5 cable that the data is transmitted on. Yes the combiners are marked 1-4 input. The jumpers on the hubs tell the hub which Cat 5 wire pairs to read 1,2,3 or 4.

I asked the same question, and actually the way the pcb is printed is confusing, there aren't 2 different things there, but just one and both jumpers need to be on the same header. It isn't "pixelnet" and "universe", but is "Pixelnet Universe" for both sets of numbers. So if the first header is on 2, the second set also needs to be on 2 to complete the circuit.

Thanks, rdebolt and jeffcoast !!

second universe channels start at 4097, and got only blue out of it, had to change to 4098 to get the red.

I'll give that a try!!  ...I have a bunch of SSCs to reconfigure.

[jeffcoast]

The actual SSCs you program starting back with 1, but in software you use zone 2 and start with 4097. Although like you said, you would think with the zones you would do it with starting at 1 again. But as you said, maybe he did it that way so the etherdongle would work and just be able to drop it in to someone that was setup for regular Dongles.

[Steve Gase]

The actual SSCs you program starting back with 1, but in software you use zone 2 and start with 4097. Although like you said, you would think with the zones you would do it with starting at 1 again. But as you said, maybe he did it that way so the etherdongle would work and just be able to drop it in to someone that was setup for regular Dongles.

Hmmm...  I'll try that change then.  (...keeping each set of SSCs configured in the range of 1-4096), but using the full range of 1-16384 within software.)

[mykroft]

You need to think logical vs physical...

remember pixelnet is ONLY 4096 channels

each usb dongle only knows how to control 4096 channels - 1 thru 4096\

when you add a controller to your software, you specify the com port etc, but also a starting channel #, that starting channel number is for the software only, on a pixelnet dongle #2, physical channel starts at 1, but logical would start at 4097 in the software if you keep them all running together in a single channel start - end range etc.


also on the dmx output, its only 4 universes per dongle, above that is logical mapping in the software....

[Steve Gase]

You need to think logical vs physical...

But somewhere logical must map to physical.

Without testing it, from what I am hearing in this thread -- LSP uses logical channels in the 1-16384 range for our pixelnet setups.  The channel numbers are passed to the pixelnet plugin as 1-16384 values.  SOMEWHERE (at the plugin, dongle or at the hub??) the logical is mapped to the physical  (phys=logical mod 4096)  The SSCs use physical channels in the range of 1-4096.

I guess I am not seeing the need to have logical and physical be mismatched, but there must be some reason... maybe the ability to remap to new devices easily...?

[mykroft]

when you drag over in LSP a pixelnet controller, the 1st thing it asks for is a channel #, this is the logical channel # that LSP keeps track of everything, then when you hit OK, it will ask for zone (not used for pixelnet usb dongles) - default to 1, then it asks for logical channel # (misleading labeling), this will be the # of channels you are going to use on that SSC.

Then when you add another, you are going to use the channel #  XX, then in the logical part, the # of channels on that SSC.

just remember you cant go over 4096 per group of SSC per dongle/com port.  After 4096 you will need to assign the next com port and start all over.

Now there is nothing that says you cant add one controller/ssc using 4096 channels - but that will get hard to manage in LSP if you want to separate out groups of channel numbers to specific items etc.

The way i set mine up is multi controllers - one per SSC, and use the logical # in LSP for the start channel # of that SSC.  I add all the indv SSC's as my show is using.  This way if you are working on just one SSC/controller or a group, you can use LSP layers to show just those channel numbers when designing/sequencing....

I hope that made sense - just remember each hub starts over at channel 1, so if you are using 4 pixelnet hubs, you can have 4 different SSCs starting at channel 1, but have a different logical channel is LSP.

LSP does all the indv mapping automagically..... you just need to keep your groups of 4096 channel separated as far as to what hub they go in etc.

The etherdongle will make all of this 100% easier, and it technically has a combiner build into it, universe 1 on pins 1/2, unv 2 on pins 3/4 etc without the need of a combiner.... but even using a etherdongle i would still setup your SSCs indv to make management easier.

As a example I have a coro northstar that i am using 2 SSC's on with rect modules (2 so I can split up power and still keep bright white instead of pink towards the end of the chain), and in my LSP i have 2 controllers setup for it, 1 for the 1st half and one for the 2nd half on their respective channels in the middle of a 4096 grp.  Then even further in LSP I have it broken up into channel groups for each leg of the star to to make sequencing easier.

Hope my rambling helped

Myk

[Steve Gase]

second universe channels start at 4097, and got only blue out of it, had to change to 4098 to get the red.

I'll give that a try!!  ...I have a bunch of SSCs to reconfigure.

I had the same thing happen to me.  I suspect a bug.  Is this a known problem or something to be expected?
On my 2nd hub I had the first SSC configured as channel 100.  That "should" have been 4096+100 or virtual channel 4196 and hub2/phys100.  I found that I had to renumber the SSCs on hub 2 to add 1 to the virtual number.  4197 needed to be the first channel for it to be red.

I'm having problems with hub 3 right now and I'll need to swap things out to see what is the problem... one I do have it working it will be interesting to see how many channels I'll need to shift for hub 3.

[mykroft]

To test hubs....  take your working hub on unv 1 and your suspect hub - put it on unv 1 as well, and put a ssc in both hubs programed to start and the same channel, output should be identical on both strings....