DiyLightAnimation
Hardware => Lynx Smart String => Topic started by: RJ on April 23, 2011,
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This is the little pcb I did to let me hook up to 4 dongles together and make a pixelnet feed for all 16,384 channels of a pixelnet multiverse.
I am going to have a little coop for them soon and get some made. They cost little and only take five rj45 jacks for parts. I am doing this since some users are going to use multiple dongles this year and it will help them get them out in one cat cable to the hubs.
RJ
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Wow thinking of everything.
Nice RJ
-JS
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RJ;
When will the PCB's be available? or better yet
When will a CoOp be starting?
Thanks Much
Pete Peters
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I'm confused - I thought the Ethernet Dongle was going to handle 16k channels?
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TNG -
Your right, but since that will probably not be ready until next year, RJ made the combiner so you can take 4 regular Lynx dongles (reprogrammed with PixalNet) and combine them into 1 CAT cable instead of having 4.
-JS
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This looks to be in lieu of a pixel net dongle (no release date yet). The purpose is to take the output from four regular dmx dongles and combine the signals to be carried from the combiner on one cat5 cable to the daisied pixlenet hubs. Without this, you'd have to have individual cat5 cables running from each dmx dongle all the way to individual hubs, none of which could handle more than the 4064 channels (1354 nodes) a single dmx dongle can output.
Ethernet dongle will make this superfluous.... once it hits the streets.
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the output of 4 Lynx Dongles (with upgraded firmware for Pixelnet) supporting 4096 channels
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I will coop the pcb as soon as the new passive 4 port hub prototype pcb is here and tested. They will be on the same coop.
RJ
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woot! woot!
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I know how this combiner works with pixelnet by taking 4 - 4000 channel networks and combining them into one 16000 network. My question is can this combiner be used to combine DMX universes so you have 4 dongles with 512 channels each go in to the combiner to make 2000 channels of DMX. Thank you in advance for thinking over my question.
Adam
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I know how this combiner works with pixelnet by taking 4 - 4000 channel networks and combining them into one 16000 network. My question is can this combiner be used to combine DMX universes so you have 4 dongles with 512 channels each go in to the combiner to make 2000 channels of DMX. Thank you in advance for thinking over my question.
Adam
Hi Adam
The combiner really is designed for the Lynx USB Dongle. The dongle firmware determines if its using pixelnet or DMX. The only gotcha is the other end of the cat5 cable which is suppose to be connected to the 16 port SS Hub. Just thinking out loud you will have to split the 4 pairs of the cat5 cable for each dmx universe.
Or I could be totally wrong
Cheers
Rick R.
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I know how this combiner works with pixelnet by taking 4 - 4000 channel networks and combining them into one 16000 network. My question is can this combiner be used to combine DMX universes so you have 4 dongles with 512 channels each go in to the combiner to make 2000 channels of DMX. Thank you in advance for thinking over my question.
Adam
Hi Adam
The combiner really is designed for the Lynx USB Dongle. The dongle firmware determines if its using pixelnet or DMX. The only gotcha is the other end of the cat5 cable which is suppose to be connected to the 16 port SS Hub. Just thinking out loud you will have to split the 4 pairs of the cat5 cable for each dmx universe.
Or I could be totally wrong
Cheers
Rick R.
I see where this is going - if you used 2 combiner's so dongle 1,2,3,4 => combiner => CAT5 => combiner = Unv 1, Unv 2, Unv 3, Unv 4
All it is doing is utilizing the wiring ... it is the same theory the SS-Hub is using. But I may be WAY off but makes since as I type.
Harrison
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Each connector on the combiner connects its pins 1 & 2 to a different pair of wires in the combined cat5 cable. If you put a combiner on each end, you should be able to trunk 4 dmx universes over 1 cat5 using the second combiner as a splitter. The only question is whether or not crosstalk between the pairs could become a problem on a very long run... (like across the street or down the block)
RM
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I doubt that cross talk is going to be much of an issue with CAT5. If it were CAT3 or flat phone wire then I would be concerned but not with CAT5.
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Cross talk will not be an issue as they are each on their own intact pair.
I love seeing you guys start seeing the big picture!
RJ
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my intention was to use two pixelnet dongles, and 2 dmx dongles going into the combiner. 1-2 pixelnet 3-4 dmx
then when i got to my first device, then breakout by using a combiner (hooked up backwards to split)
say it was an express, 1-2 would just jumper (short ethernet cable) into another combiner
one of the 3-4 would go into the express, then output into the combiner, the last dmx channel would go back into the combiner
then all 4 could run to the next device.
now, if i wanted to branch off something (maybe i wanted one of my pixelnet to go off in a new direction, then i'd just not hook that line up again, and just send it off in the direction it needed to go.
originally i was going to get 10 combiners, before i had to drop out
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This sounds far more complicated than it needs to be but if that is what works for you then go for it. I will just let the SmartString hubs break out the DMX for me. I have ordered one combiner just in case the Ethernet Hub is not completed in time so that if I need more than 1 PixelNet universe to deal with everything, I'm good to go with multiple Lynks dongles flashed for PixelNet.
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well, i wanted to keep my pixelnet, and dmx seperate. so i dont lose my mind in the sequencing software.
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well, i wanted to keep my pixelnet, and dmx seperate. so i dont lose my mind in the sequencing software.
ahhh, Come on lose your mind. ITS FUN ;D
Rick R.
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I guess that's the part that I don't understand. All you need to do is reserve either the first or last 512 addresses for DMX and they are seperated. If you need more than 512 DMX channels then as long as you have more than 1 SmartString hub, reserve either the first or last 1024 channels for DMX and have the one hub deliver the first DMX universe and another hub can deliver the other one. The reason that I'm suggesting this is that this way you can keep your seperation while saving the cost of two to three dongles as well as a few combiners. It will also be a much more simple configuration and much less load on the PC with it driving 1 dongle compared to trying to drive up to 4 seperate dongles. But the great thing about DIY is that for the most part you have the freedom to do it the way that you want to so if you do it the way you initially suggested, please post the results. I'm curious to see how this way works, both good and bad.
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tbone,
You do understand a lynx dongle can only output a quarter of a pixlenet universe and to get the full universe you need 4 doungles and a combiner to getit
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tbone,
You do understand a lynx dongle can only output a quarter of a pixlenet universe and to get the full universe you need 4 doungles and a combiner to getit
I am sorry my friend but you are the one that is incorrect. A PixelNt universe is 4096 channels and IS put out in full by a SINGLE Lynks dongle flashed for PixelNet. The combiner allows you to put out up to 4 PixelNet universes on a single cable just like the Ethernet Dongle will do when released
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The confusion probably lies in the fact that all of our dongles currently can only do the 512, until RJ releases the pixelnet firmware for the dongle to the masses. Then we will all be able to convert each one to do the 4096 channels as Tbone is talking about. As for not getting confused, doesn't all of the software let you color code each channel, so I would think it wouldn't be that hard to had all the stuff, DMX and Pixelnet, at once, and then just color the similar stuff together in the software. I think I am going to like the way Lightshow Pro does it with the Layers, so you can hide everything that isn't in that layer.
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I don't think that that is the issue. I think that where people are getting confused is thinking that the 16384 channel output of the upcoming Ethernet dongle is one PixelNet universe. That is simply not the case. The Ethernet dongle produces this massive channel count by producing 4 seperate PixelNet universes, each one on its own pair. If you look at the 16 port hub, you will see a set of jumpers that tell it which pair (or universe) that the hub will be working with.
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This is correct.
There is never more than 4096 channels in a pixelnet universe.
One active Hub = 1 universe. No hub will output more than 4096 channels to the SSC's attached to it. It will always be the 4096 channels it is jumpered to operate on.
A cat5 cable can carry up to 4 pixelnet universes by either being hooked to a combiner getting the data from Lynx Dongles flashes with pixelnet code or by being plugged into a EtherDongle which will put the 4 universes on the same cat5 itself.
When you have multiple pixelnet universes (8192 or 12288 or 16384 channels) together on the cable this is called a multiverse.
So something puts out pixelnet (1 - 4 universes on the wire) then the hub picks the 4096 channels of one of the universes based on your jumper setting on that hub. Then it outputs all 4096 channels to the SSC's hooked to it. It also then outputs 512 channels of that 4096 DMX. Which of 4096 is output as DMX is selected by a jumper on the hub picking one of the eight sections of 512 channels inside 4096 channel. 1-512, 513-1024, 1025 - 1536 .....
So if you want to have a hub on pixelnet universe 2 the first channel address it sees is 4097, If you then jumper the DMX to output the 8th section of it's channels as DMX your DMX channel one would start at channel #7681.
This is because your hub starts at 4097 (universe #2) your DMX is the eigth set of DMX inside of them so you are skipping the first 7 sections of 512 channels.
4097 + 7 * 512 = 7681
This Excel sheet makes it easy for you.
Rick will you post this in the wiki for me with the Smart Strings information?
RJ
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So if you want to use all 4096 for SSCs would you just not jumper any of the DMX jumpers?
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So if you want to use all 4096 for SSCs would you just not jumper any of the DMX jumpers?
You can always use all 4096 for the SSC even when you are send DMX out. The DMX out does not remove the channels it just makes DMX data from them and sends it out.
So the real answer is you can jumper any DMX jumper and use all 4096 on the SSC's.
Hope this clears it up for you.
RJ
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So if you jumper DMX to start at 1 - 512, then the Pixelnet address are still 1-4096? Also when daisy chaining the hubs is the second hub in the same universe as hub 1 or can it be universe 2?
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So if you jumper DMX to start at 1 - 512, then the Pixelnet address are still 1-4096? Also when daisy chaining the hubs is the second hub in the same universe as hub 1 or can it be universe 2?
If you are using the lynx dongle it can only be on the same universe as the other hub. Since that dongle can only send out one universe.
If you are using two or more lynx dongles and using the combiner then the other hub can be on the second universe.
If you are using the not released yet EtherDongle than the other hub or hubs can be any of the 4 universes.
Cheers
Rick R.
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Yes if you use DMX #1 and universe #1 then the channels are all still 1 - 4096. The pixelnet channels avaliable are 1 - 4096.
You have DMX coming out of the hub matching 1 - 512 of pixelnet.
So if you want 512 channels of DMX and then the start of your pixels, you address you first dmx device to start at channel #1 and you first SSC would be addressed to start at channel #513.
It is much simpler than you are thinking. The hub always puts out the 4096 channels of pixelnet it is set to no matter what you do with the dmx. The dmx is just a copy of 512 channels of the pixelnet converted to DMX for you to use on DMX items.
So if you move your DMX to #2 then it is all the same for pixelnet 1 - 4096 but now your 512 channels of DMX will match pixelnet Channels 513-1023 but you will still have pixelnet 1 - 4096 going to your SSC's so if you have a SSC addressed at ch 513 and a dmx device addressed as #1 (1st channel of second dmx group in the pixelnet 4096 = 513) they see the same data.
Now it you are using a Combiner on your dongles or the Etherdongle you can daisy chain the data from hub #1 to hub #2 and set hub #2 to pixelnet universe #2 and it can get the pixelnet channels # 4097 - 8193. You can then set the hub #2 DMX output to #1 and get channels 4097 - 4609 (512ch) out of it as DMX.
Hope this helps.
RJ
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I don't know why but for some reason I just can not wrap my head around this. I don't think it is the way anyone is explaining it, I just am confused.
I think my problem is this...
If I have my hub as universe 1 and set it to output the first 512 channels of DMX (start channel 1), will those first 512 DMX channels do the same thing as the first 512 channels of SS's? Or are the 512 channels of DMX completely independent of the 4096 channels of SS's?
Greg
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They will do the same thing.
The dmx converter portion of the hub does not alter the pixelnet data in any way. It simply mirrors a 512 channel block as dmx on a separate connector.
All 4096 channels of p-net data are always output on all p-net connectors. The individual string addresses are set in the ssc along with the color order data, node order data, and string/pixel mode of operation.
RM
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if you setup dmx to be 1st dmx universe off of a pixelnet hub, and had an express on it set to start with dmx channel 1. and also.... had a ssc running on that same same hub set to pixelnet channel 1....
in vixen, channel 1 would be the first channel on the express AND the Red value on the first pixelnet node.
channel 2 would be the 2nd channel on the express, AND the Green value on the first pixelnet node.
channel 3 would be the 3rd channel on the express, AND the Blue value on the first pixelnet node.
channel 4 would be the 4th channel on the express, AND the Red value on the second pixelnet node.
etc.
etc.
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I was wondering IF the SS Combiner could be used to connect a Rainbow Flood with and MR16 ? As I understand it from the Rainbow manual the three color chans are branched off via the RJ45 pairs much like the Pixelnet Universes. Which is what the combiner was mad to do.
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While I'm sure that you can my question is why would you? Since the MR16 uses lugs anyway, why not just make a cable that has an RJ45 on one end and female lugs on the other. In order to use the Combiner on this you will need to do that anyway but in the combiner case, you would need to build 3 of them plus purchase and assemble the combiner. Much more work with no advantage in doing it.
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Ok, thanks - not all that familiar with the MR16 - didn't realize it uses lugs. I purchased a couple of Rainbow floods and saw that the MR16 could be used with it and since there is a coop underway, it would be cheaper than buying the Rainbow Brain so I wanted to go with the MR16. The combiner was a random thought I had while reading the Floods manual.
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They are both 16 channel DC controllers so either one will work. The only advantage the Rainbow Brain has is its outputs are configured to work directly with the Rainbow floods but the cost savings using the MR16 more than makes up for it IMHO and making the adapter cables shouldn't be much of a big deal.
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Here is a picture TNG with the lugs to cat 5. I bought the female to female couplers off ebay. (here is 20 for $9 shipped http://cgi.ebay.com/Wholesale-lot-20x-RJ45-CAT5E-Network-Adapter-Coupler-/180653239580?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a0fc5ad1c )
With the rainbow connector and a coupler on the mr-16 dc controller, I can use any patch cable between them.
Ron
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Thx for the pix - however, I think it confused me. I am going to post a wiring question over in the MR16 section to keep this thread on topic.