DiyLightAnimation
Hardware => Lynx Smart String => Topic started by: sirloinofbeef001 on November 03, 2013,
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This question has been asked by many ppl includung me. The reason has never been clear for me tho. The limits between the ssc and the first node is 10' with(x) amount of nodes. What is x and if its not more footage of line with fewer nodes, then why? Im using 75 nodes on my mega tree and 35 nodes on my arches. Is it possible to push the limit higher with the arches being only 35 nodes? My reason is that I want all my ssc's in a marine battery box by the mega tree. My mega tree will be separated by 30' from my arches... Is there an option for this if the 10' limit is a hard number?
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its also been suggested that this same info be collected for each SSC in a table in the wiki. there is so much info in the threads that is contradictory or nuanced that it makes it difficult to convey when this question is asked. we should collect the data for all controllers -- before the controller, and after the controller to the pixels/lights.
i'll volunteer to put it in the wiki if people can provide the accurate data.
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Steve, what is the worst thing that could happen if I stretch it to 20' or more? With just the 35 node arches.
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IIRC, the issue is the repetition of the signal by the node. You can have over 100' of cat5 cable between your Hub and your SSC. (RJ did this his first year with his pixel tree) It's when you have greater than 2' of distance between your SSC and your first node that you'll have issues or have greater than 6' of distance between nodes that you'll start to lose some of the data for your nodes. (This is the reason for the null nodes) I know that I had three runs of over 25' last year between my HUB and my SSCs, but the distance between my SSC and node was less than a foot.
Hope this helps!
Duane
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This bring to thought, what about using cat 5 between the ssc and the first node? Since the cat 5 can bring it so far TOO the ssc, if we tried a long length of cat 5 from the ssc to the node, we can eliminate one of the variables. Either the SSC does not drive as hard as a hub, or the string wiring itself starts to corrupt the data.
And I would postulate it is because it is not twisted pair in the node strings.
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later today Im gonna test it out with cat5 cable with small increments til I see a problem... It will answer the question.
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My reason is that I want all my ssc's in a marine battery box by the mega tree. My mega tree will be separated by 30' from my arches... Is there an option for this if the 10' limit is a hard number?
I don't understand this?
Why the SSCs in one spot in a box?
RJ design the system to put the power supply and hub in a box and the SSCs can be all over the yard with cat5 cable.
If the SSCs are inside a piece of pipe and the cat5 connection is protect then there is no problem.
Going from the Hub to SSC can be far but between the ssc and first node is shorter. Maybe you are just using the wrong product if the Smart String design doesn't work for you. No reason to put a square block in a round hole.
The public beta testing of the SSC v4. zwiller, rdebolt,?
SSC v4 to first node seems to be 12' max while Hub to SSC can be 100'
SSC v1,2,3 SSC to first node is a few inches up to 2 feet and Hub to SSC can be 100'
There is really not way to say that a certain SSC to first node is absolute distance because there are variables like is the first node to SSC hardwired or using a 3 plug connector. How many nodes are connected. etc
Rick R.
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CAT5 will NOT provide any benefit between the controller and the first node or between nodes. The lines between the hubs an between the hub and the controller are probably using RS422 or a similar protocol that uses a dedicated pair of wires to send the signal. With this setup, all of the noise being created is external and the twisted pair helps to cancel most of that out. The nodes are probably using something like RS232 which uses a common zero line which in this case happens to be the power ground as well. The issue with this is that interference can be generated on the ground wire by other components using it for power and twisted pair does little to cancel that out. This is probably where the X comes in on that equation. The more nodes you have and the farther apart they are, the more the voltage drop and the interference that they can create resulting in a shorter distance between the controller and the first node before that interference alters the input signal.
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"twiller" I probably deserve that... ;D
RJ was optimistic about 25' from a design standpoint. My testing proved otherwise but I would certainly like other members to test themselves. It would be really cool if other members found out they could go farther as RJ expected.
Stick a null node in there and you are well over 20'. Before the SSCv4 beta I considered null nodes and grouping functions taboo, but they work perfectly.
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"twiller" I probably deserve that... ;D
RJ was optimistic about 25' from a design standpoint. My testing proved otherwise but I would certainly like other members to test themselves. It would be really cool if other members found out they could go farther as RJ expected.
Stick a null node in there and you are well over 20'. Before the SSCv4 beta I considered null nodes and grouping functions taboo, but they work perfectly.
Sorry I am hurting today and on lots of meds. It was just a typo. I really appreciate the work you have done.
Rick R.
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CAT5 will NOT provide any benefit between the controller and the first node or between nodes. The lines between the hubs an between the hub and the controller are probably using RS422 or a similar protocol that uses a dedicated pair of wires to send the signal. With this setup, all of the noise being created is external and the twisted pair helps to cancel most of that out. The nodes are probably using something like RS232 which uses a common zero line which in this case happens to be the power ground as well. The issue with this is that interference can be generated on the ground wire by other components using it for power and twisted pair does little to cancel that out. This is probably where the X comes in on that equation. The more nodes you have and the farther apart they are, the more the voltage drop and the interference that they can create resulting in a shorter distance between the controller and the first node before that interference alters the input signal.
Did I mess up some where? I don't think I was suggesting using cat5 between ssc and nodes. Just from the hub to the ssc.
Rick R.
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Sorry Rick, my replay was not to your post but to arw01's post above yours. I guess that I should have quoted the post I was replying to but sometimes things are missed.
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good info in here... i'll grab it up later to create that wiki page, and then ask you to review.
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The v3 was a little better than 2 feet. I think it was up to about 6'. V2 was about 2'. The symptoms I remember is the first node will be a different color than the rest. And the rest will often be the wrong color.
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I have not tested the Zeus distance, but I would think that it will be similar to the SSC V4. During testing of the V4 I was able to drive regular nodes with 122 node string with a 6 ft lead (SSC to first node). At 10 feet I started losing control of the end nodes. So I would say that the SSC V4 would work ok on regular nodes up to around 8 feet. Now with flex strips I had different results. I was able to go 15 feet without any issues on a 120 node string. At 20 feet I did run into issues. So there again I would say somewhere between 15 to 16 feet would be the limit with flex strips. I did not test distance on any other nodes.
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Smart String wiki created!
Please review and provide feedback/improvements/corrections.
I've consolidated the information (as I understand it) to draw comparisons between the various SSC, DSC and Zeus controllers. (including wire lengths)
http://www.diylightanimation.com/wiki/index.php?title=SSC_Comparison (http://www.diylightanimation.com/wiki/index.php?title=SSC_Comparison)
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I guess the word MAX should be there for the distance lengths.
Rick R.
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I guess the word MAX should be there for the distance lengths.
Rick R.
got it. thx!
By the way, I interpret "MAX" to be maximum, reliable distance.
While there might be anecdotal information that "I ran pixelnet with 300ft", the data that we should convey here is information that you'd build a show upon. If we say that a range is between 6 and 60, we should definitely communicate the "6". Maybe we can say something as well -- "up to 60". ...i don't know how to keep it simple, we want it to be clear of confusion.
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Looks great, thanks.
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Nice work Steve