RGB Configurator spreadsheet

[smeighan]

I have built a spreadsheet for myself to compare the different ways to build up an rgb display. I did this so I could compare prices and observe how prices have step functions. If you are using a board that can drive 12 strings and you want to have 14 strings, now you need two boards.


you can find the OpenOffice and Excel spreadsheets on the releases page.
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Try it out. Try string counts of 8,12,16,20,32 .etc.

I would ask that this not turn into a war about which controller is better. I am unbiased. I just wanted to compare data. I am using Pixelnet now, my next expansion may be to j1sys p12r or e682.

Some notes:
I tried to use the prices posted on pages. I have not used most of what i put here, please post corrections to things i got wrong.

I am not trying to compare features. That is probably another exercise. For example

Pixelnet Active hubs: only drive 180x strings
Pixelnet Zeus hub: 180x and ws2811
dpitts/mykroft board: 180x and ws2811
p12r: WS2801, LPD6803, and TM180x
e682: GE pixels, 1804, 1903, 2801, 2811 , 3001, 3005, 6803, 8806 , 9813

So by the number of pixel types e682 is the champ. But I own 1809 strings so i dont need the extra types.

Others:
Pixelnet Active hubs: drives 16 strings
Pixelnet Zeus hub: drives 16 strings
dpitts/mykroft board: drives 16 strings
p12r: drives 12 strings
e682: drives 16 strings.

But the p12r can have the most pixels.

This is what i mean about comparing features. The spreadsheet was only meant to get an idea of the cost of the different choices.

I assumed all strings would be mounted on 1/2" 10' emt like i did for my megatree. Since they are the same for all 5 choices they dont effect the price. It does remind people you have to budget for mounting your rgb device.
Likewise i used a marine battery case for mounting power supplies and boards for all 5.

I couldnt find Ray Wu's link to the 12v ws2811. Can someone post it?
I didnt see a price for the p12r as a kit. so 4 of the 5 are kits and the p12r is a completely assembled board. Probably adds $70 as compared to the other 4.

What this spreadsheet shows me is
the largest cost are the strings
the cost takes some big steps when you cross the boundary requiring a new board


hope it is helpful.

sean

[smeighan]

posted version 3 of spreadsheet

This has updated price for ws2811 12v flex strips and updated links
corrected two places where the sum was missing the first line.

[smeighan]

released version 4

added 6th hardware choice, LOR CCR
made all hyperlinks in spreadsheet clickable

[towtruck]

This is a great spreadsheet and I can now happily throw away all the little scraps of paper I have been figuring prices on.

Thanks,
Steve

[Gary]

I'm trying to wrap my head around all this RGB stuff (namely the different ICs for the pixels)... I was looking at your spreadsheet, and option #2 (the Zeus), your notes indicate 10 nodes per meter, but the Aliexpress URL indicates that is has 30 per meter, like option 1.

[smeighan]

I'm trying to wrap my head around all this RGB stuff (namely the different ICs for the pixels)... I was looking at your spreadsheet, and option #2 (the Zeus), your notes indicate 10 nodes per meter, but the Aliexpress URL indicates that is has 30 per meter, like option 1.

I understand that RJ is planning on supporting the 2811 besides the 1809 on his Zeus controller.

The 1809 flex strip has 30 nodes per meter, 10 IC chips per meter. What is unique about the 1809 is the each IC chip has 9 outputs and can control 3 nodes. So the 120 nodes on the 1809 are all individually controlled. So you have 120 nodes for the sequencer to control.
4m long flex strip is $42
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The other hardware, the ws2811. It has 30 nodes per meter, 10 IC's per meter. The difference is the 10 ICs only have 3 outputs. so 3 nodes are tied together. although you have 150 nodes on the ws2811, we can only turn them on in groups of 3 so we address this as a 50 node string.
so the 150 nodes on the ws2811 looks to our sequencers as only having 50 nodes (each node here is a group of 3 nodes)

The big advantage of ws2811? It is alot cheaper than 1809. a 5m flex strip is $32, a 4m 1809 is $42.
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I know the nodes per meter, IC's per meter can be confusing.

[tomwb301]

Sean,

Another line item might be a passive hub.

[smeighan]

Sean,

Another line item might be a passive hub.

Yep, i was thinking about that. I have two hubs , one is active, one is passive. Since the difference in price is just $20, i decided not to write the more complicated logic to include it.

The people who use the j1sys ecg-p12r sent a pm that i got the board count wrong. On the p12r you can have 170 pixels per connector.
So since the ws2811 has "50" nodes, even though the flex strip has 150 nodes. the ws2811 has 30 nodes per meter and 10 ics. Unlike the 1809 which has 9 outputs, the ws2811 drives 3 nodes in a group and counts them as 1 node. so my 5m 2811 that has 150 nodes is viewed as a 50 node flex strip. On the p12r people connect 3 of these (15 meters!) to one connector.

If I buy 32 ws2811 flex strips they can all be driven with 1 p12r. Now you do need to do power injection to be driving that much. But i originally had calculated 3 p12r's (32 strings divided by 12 connectors per p2r).

I am happy to correct these kind of issues so that the configurator comes closer to how people are using them.

I built the spreadsheet so i could compare different string counts.

try 1 string and see what the minimal cost would be for someone to get started.

8 strings in a ray configuration can be very nice. For most of the controllers you can enter into RGB with 8 strings for under $600.

[Gary]

I understand that RJ is planning on supporting the 2811 besides the 1809 on his Zeus controller.

The 1809 flex strip has 30 nodes per meter, 10 IC chips per meter. What is unique about the 1809 is the each IC chip has 9 outputs and can control 3 nodes. So the 120 nodes on the 1809 are all individually controlled. So you have 120 nodes for the sequencer to control.
4m long flex strip is $42
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The other hardware, the ws2811. It has 30 nodes per meter, 10 IC's per meter. The difference is the 10 ICs only have 3 outputs. so 3 nodes are tied together. although you have 150 nodes on the ws2811, we can only turn them on in groups of 3 so we address this as a 50 node string.
so the 150 nodes on the ws2811 looks to our sequencers as only having 50 nodes (each node here is a group of 3 nodes)

The big advantage of ws2811? It is alot cheaper than 1809. a 5m flex strip is $32, a 4m 1809 is $42.
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So the Zeus will ONLY support ribbons with 1809, and the Active Hub/Controller setup will ONLY support strings/ribbons with 2811?

Okay, now I understand that in the sequencing software I would only have to sequence 50 pixels, even though I have 150 points of light output per ribbon. Can the circuit boards and cabling handle a larger power supply? That I'm getting at is that we were originally told that we can have 128 nodes per string due to watt/amp limits over CAT5/6 Cable.

I'm pretty familiar with RJ's Smart String stuff, but what are the pros and cons of the J1Sys and SanDevices stuff? If I'm not mistaken, the J1Sys and SanDevices stuff doesn't have the equivalent of the individual controllers (i.e. the thing in the plastic pipe) per string/ribbon, so is there a more constraining limit to how far away the first pixel in each string can be from the unit? Looking at pictures of them, they also don't seem to have a data pass-though for daisy chaining, and they don't seem to use cheap and plentiful PC ATX power supplies, either. I did notice that you had the same price for all the power supplies in your spreadsheet, though.

[dpitts]

Looking at pictures of them, they also don't seem to have a data pass-though for daisy chaining, and they don't seem to use cheap and plentiful PC ATX power supplies, either. I did notice that you had the same price for all the power supplies in your spreadsheet, though.

The power supplies they use can be bought from Ray for $20-$32 depending on quality and most of the controllers including the dpitts/mycroft needs two supplies to drive all 16 strings. I will state for the record the dpitts/mycroft controller will control up to at least 170 and most likely 200 per string but you may need to power inject if you are running all of them all white.

[smeighan]

I understand that RJ is planning on supporting the 2811 besides the 1809 on his Zeus controller.

The 1809 flex strip has 30 nodes per meter, 10 IC chips per meter. What is unique about the 1809 is the each IC chip has 9 outputs and can control 3 nodes. So the 120 nodes on the 1809 are all individually controlled. So you have 120 nodes for the sequencer to control.
4m long flex strip is $42
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

The other hardware, the ws2811. It has 30 nodes per meter, 10 IC's per meter. The difference is the 10 ICs only have 3 outputs. so 3 nodes are tied together. although you have 150 nodes on the ws2811, we can only turn them on in groups of 3 so we address this as a 50 node string.
so the 150 nodes on the ws2811 looks to our sequencers as only having 50 nodes (each node here is a group of 3 nodes)

The big advantage of ws2811? It is alot cheaper than 1809. a 5m flex strip is $32, a 4m 1809 is $42.
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So the Zeus will ONLY support ribbons with 1809, and the Active Hub/Controller setup will ONLY support strings/ribbons with 2811?

Okay, now I understand that in the sequencing software I would only have to sequence 50 pixels, even though I have 150 points of light output per ribbon. Can the circuit boards and cabling handle a larger power supply? That I'm getting at is that we were originally told that we can have 128 nodes per string due to watt/amp limits over CAT5/6 Cable.

I'm pretty familiar with RJ's Smart String stuff, but what are the pros and cons of the J1Sys and SanDevices stuff? If I'm not mistaken, the J1Sys and SanDevices stuff doesn't have the equivalent of the individual controllers (i.e. the thing in the plastic pipe) per string/ribbon, so is there a more constraining limit to how far away the first pixel in each string can be from the unit? Looking at pictures of them, they also don't seem to have a data pass-though for daisy chaining, and they don't seem to use cheap and plentiful PC ATX power supplies, either. I did notice that you had the same price for all the power supplies in your spreadsheet, though.

I put in a general place holder for power supplies. i know some people are using the 350w , $20 power supplies from Ray Wu. Think of the line as more "You need to remember to buy power supplies".

The Pixelnet Active hub can drive, i think, a hundred meters per connector. It has a driver built into the hub. We need the smart string controller to be the receiver. The p12r does not have the ability to drive hundreds of meters. People have told me they have driven their lights 20-30 feet away with no issue. On megatrees you normally are right next to the controller. the p12r comes with an option to buy a driver/receiver set of boards and now you can drive 100 meters. this board set costs $20 or so per line.
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The spreadsheet puts all controllers in one place where people can get an idea of the choices that are out there.

[tomwb301]

Great job Sean. It will help with budgets.

[FireMedic4Christ]

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. . .
The other hardware, the ws2811. It has 30 nodes per meter, 10 IC's per meter. The difference is the 10 ICs only have 3 outputs. so 3 nodes are tied together. although you have 150 nodes on the ws2811, we can only turn them on in groups of 3 so we address this as a 50 node string.
so the 150 nodes on the ws2811 looks to our sequencers as only having 50 nodes (each node here is a group of 3 nodes)
. . .

 
So the ws2811 would not be a good choice for a mega tree or matrix type signage because you have to turn on the nodes in groups of three. This would cause you to lose some of your details in pictures and make it harder to using fonts for text.
Thanks for helping us understand better.
Brian

[smeighan]

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. . .
The other hardware, the ws2811. It has 30 nodes per meter, 10 IC's per meter. The difference is the 10 ICs only have 3 outputs. so 3 nodes are tied together. although you have 150 nodes on the ws2811, we can only turn them on in groups of 3 so we address this as a 50 node string.
so the 150 nodes on the ws2811 looks to our sequencers as only having 50 nodes (each node here is a group of 3 nodes)
. . .

 
So the ws2811 would not be a good choice for a mega tree or matrix type signage because you have to turn on the nodes in groups of three. This would cause you to lose some of your details in pictures and make it harder to using fonts for text.
Thanks for helping us understand better.
Brian

not nessarily. I , in fact, am thinking of making a megatree out of 2811.

Here was my issue with 1809. 120 nodes, individually control;led. great! spacing between nodes 1.3", not so good. Because when you put a picture up the vertical spacing is 3 times denser than the horizontal. The top of the tree had 1-2" spacing between segments. at the bottom, teh spacing was 10". The middle of the tree had around 6". If you made your tree out of
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you have 3-4" vertical spacing.

I believe that having the nodes groups in 3's may make the pictures look better. There will be an issue with my showstorm and showflake. You wont be able to get individual nodes turned on.

Look at fast eddy's show. he has the ws2811 in a ray configuration
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Look at around 2:20 and you can see th white is being turned on in groups of 3's. But overall, the effects on this still look ok.

i will probably get ws2811's thi syear and decide if i want ti for my megatree or use it elsewhere. i already have 20x120 1809's. They worked great, btw.

thanks

[JonB256]

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. . .
The other hardware, the ws2811. It has 30 nodes per meter, 10 IC's per meter. The difference is the 10 ICs only have 3 outputs. so 3 nodes are tied together. although you have 150 nodes on the ws2811, we can only turn them on in groups of 3 so we address this as a 50 node string.
so the 150 nodes on the ws2811 looks to our sequencers as only having 50 nodes (each node here is a group of 3 nodes)
. . .

 
So the ws2811 would not be a good choice for a mega tree or matrix type signage because you have to turn on the nodes in groups of three. This would cause you to lose some of your details in pictures and make it harder to using fonts for text.
Thanks for helping us understand better.
Brian

Brian, I'm looking at the WS2811 strips to go horizontally across a garage door. I'm thinking that the vertical spacing between the strips would determine how effective these "3 led per pixel" strips would be.  Keep in mind that the LOR Cosmic Color Ribbons have always been this way and get a lot of use.