DiyLightAnimation
Fun => The Porch => Topic started by: chrisatpsu on January 11, 2013,
-
Comment any advice for your design you used..
-
I did a full mega tree using incans in 2012( 48 strands/24 channels). If doing a tree with SS nodes or flexstrips, I would do 1/2 circle.
-
I had a 32 string 50 node full tree for 2011 and 2012. I am building a 24 string 50 node half tree this year in addition to my full tree. Half trees and full trees are both cool. My new half tree will be more flat with a slight arc at the bottom. Better for drawing graphics on. I really like the webbing approach for building trees.
-
I have always used a full tree and will do so again in 2013, but if I were to move my tree back and make it a half tree it would really open up my very small lawn for some more items. I just have not figured out what yet.
-
Are you asking about pixel trees or just in general? My led tree is full but if I was to do a pixel tree it would be a semi-circle.
-
Are you asking about pixel trees or just in general? My led tree is full but if I was to do a pixel tree it would be a semi-circle.
you're explanation is good enough! :)
-
this year, i had a 16 string incan megatree (run by an express) full circle
and a 16 string - 40 node smart string mega tree (full circle)
after looking more into nutcracker, I'm thinking of maybe moving the smart string tree to a half circle...
-
I guess I am the only one but my family and I are not overly impressed with mega trees that have text or graphics. Also, I know you need it to keep it more matrix style, but we don't care the flat tops on these trees.
Am thinking 16 string half circle with 60 nodes on 2.5" centers. I need to do some more research whether it best or not to "fold" the string and use 1 ssc for 2 strings.
-
2012 was my first year with a mega tree. I used conventional leds with my tree up against the house. It actually turned out much better than I thought it would. I am thinking about a full circle and rgb ssc's for 2013, but may stick with the half circle with the rgb's.
-
Half tree
4 strings of 72 nodes folded in half at the top to make 8 strands of 36
4 sscs
10 feet tall with a 3" PVC middle pole anchored by an 80 lb poured concrete base in a bin
Cut the 10' pole about 10" from bottom and used threaded adapters to make the upper 9' removable from the base
Used 10' long 3/4" PVC and taped every other node to relieve the weight of the string from pulling on connections
Each of the 8 PVC pipes were anchored to ground with tent stakes to maintain their semi-circle shape and position
Had some windy days and it did not budge
I am considering going taller and more dense (pixel spacing and more vertical strands) this year
-
I am planning on a half mega tree based on Sean's. Where we are planning to put it you really can not see it from the back.
Rick
-
Am thinking 16 string half circle with 60 nodes on 2.5" centers. I need to do some more research whether it best or not to "fold" the string and use 1 ssc for 2 strings.
I used folded strings in 2012
Was no issue for all the nutcracker generated effects, BUT there were some things I wanted to do that I could not figure out how to accomplish in nutcracker so I did by hand in vixen ... Got very complicated because of the folds
I'll either go to one ssc per vertical strand, or create a program to manipulate my routines as needed for these portions, or figure out how to do what I want with nutcracker or xlights to avoid this going forward
If using smart strings in hybrid mode Then 1 ssc per vertical strand enables easier programming of simple routines as well
-
I guess I am the only one but my family and I are not overly impressed with mega trees that have text or graphics. Also, I know you need it to keep it more matrix style, but we don't care the flat tops on these trees.
Am thinking 16 string half circle with 60 nodes on 2.5" centers. I need to do some more research whether it best or not to "fold" the string and use 1 ssc for 2 strings.
2011, i did the same rgb mege tree, but with 8 strings f 80 nodes, folded over... it made it a little more complicated in vixen, but i still managed... I know you use lsp, but it was enough for me to just switch to each having it''s own string. easier to manage with replacing nodes as well after they were on.
-
My tree this year was only incad. Other years it has always been full circle. I think full circle is important for the effect but I have a layer of multi full circle in 12 slices and then I have a half circle of green in 6 slices and then I have 5 horizontal stripes of both red and green and they are only half circle as well. I only did half because I would have needed more lights. If you tend to watch the light show from different angles you may not like it like that.
Zac
-
I had a 32 string 50 node full tree for 2011 and 2012. I am building a 24 string 50 node half tree this year in addition to my full tree. Half trees and full trees are both cool. My new half tree will be more flat with a slight arc at the bottom. Better for drawing graphics on. I really like the webbing approach for building trees.
What is the "webbing approach"?
-
I had a 32 string 50 node full tree for 2011 and 2012. I am building a 24 string 50 node half tree this year in addition to my full tree. Half trees and full trees are both cool. My new half tree will be more flat with a slight arc at the bottom. Better for drawing graphics on. I really like the webbing approach for building trees.
What is the "webbing approach"?
1" Poly webbing with 3/8 holes burned in it for every node. No zip ties or tape needed. I did 1600 nodes in one day.
http://www.rochfordsupply.com/shop/Webbing/Polypropylene_Webbing/Webbing_-_Heavy__1_inch_Poly/index.html
-
I had a 32 string 50 node full tree for 2011 and 2012. I am building a 24 string 50 node half tree this year in addition to my full tree. Half trees and full trees are both cool. My new half tree will be more flat with a slight arc at the bottom. Better for drawing graphics on. I really like the webbing approach for building trees.
What is the "webbing approach"?
1" Poly webbing with 3/8 holes burned in it for every node. No zip ties or tape needed. I did 1600 nodes in one day.
http://www.rochfordsupply.com/shop/Webbing/Polypropylene_Webbing/Webbing_-_Heavy__1_inch_Poly/index.html (http://www.rochfordsupply.com/shop/Webbing/Polypropylene_Webbing/Webbing_-_Heavy__1_inch_Poly/index.html)
That looks like good material. It seems to be based on Monkhouse's packing straps idea... but without the hassle of electrical tape to hold it flat.
How well does it work in keeping the pixels uniformly straight? (better than the flat straps?)
What about weight? is it noticebly heavy? about the same as the straps?
(i've heard that some people trying the plastic strapping material may go to the metal instead...)
thanks!
-
It depends on budget and your location.
Most locations don't really benefit from a full tree and its twice the cost and you won't see the backside very well .
If budget is no issue and you got the time .... Then full is best I suppose.
I saw Sean's 1/2 tree and it was plenty good for me. It was way more spectacular than my 18' full incandescent megatree ... Way more wow factor !
-
i did a 40 channel 40 led string full tree for my first year. i am definitely going with an rgb tree this year, i am in the planning stage right now trying to figure out if i want a half tree or full tree. the problem in my yard is the room i have, i am cursed(blessed) with a big front yard. i almost have to have a full tree with my set up, at least 3/4 if possible. if i do a half a tree, i would have to move it further back in the yard and it won't be visible from one side of the yard. the position of tree now would have to be a full tree because you can see 3/4 of the tree. decisions, decisions...
my 2 cents
duane
-
i may continue with the full because I already have the "portable hole" and tall metal pipe with winch, etc.
but I see a lot of value with the half tree because (for the same investment) it allows you to more tightly pack the lights where the effects can stand out. if you have 48 strings on a tall tree, the strings are fairly far apart at the bottom. if you put the same 48 all to the front, the doubled density will allow the "raster" effects to work more effectively.
-
That looks like good material. It seems to be based on Monkhouse's packing straps idea... but without the hassle of electrical tape to hold it flat.
How well does it work in keeping the pixels uniformly straight? (better than the flat straps?)
What about weight? is it noticebly heavy? about the same as the straps?
(i've heard that some people trying the plastic strapping material may go to the metal instead...)
thanks!
The nodes stay extremely straight. I cannot compare to strapping method because I have not used that method (too many zip ties or tape for me). Never thought about the weight, it has not been an issue. The straps are pretty strong.
-
hmmm, i guess if i make a full tree, sometimes i could just do half tree effects.....
-
The nodes stay extremely straight. I cannot compare to strapping method because I have not used that method (too many zip ties or tape for me). Never thought about the weight, it has not been an issue. The straps are pretty strong.
Not to high jack this thread Chris, but since I am stealing dpitts ideas any way. Do you have any picture of your tree setup?
-
i run it one more time tonight before I tear it down. haven't run it since Jan 2nd. I'll take a pic.
basically 2in pvc held up by 4 ropes in each of the compass directions. then 16 strings hang from the top, so basically it has 20 guys wires.
the 2in pvc expands to a 3in then into a flange that holds an arcylic ball on top with a ssc and 6 metal squares inside to light it up.
here's a pic from when i first turned it on...
(http://i1059.photobucket.com/albums/t438/chrisatpsu/IMAG0325.jpg)
there are three battery boxes at the base, one with the hub, and 2 that held SSC's out of the weather.
-
Not trying to get off topic, but when you said you are storing your SSCs in a battery box and it seems to me we all agree the best way to string a mega tree is to use separate SSc's per string AND with all of the interest in SS mega trees... What if there was a mega tree controller (MTC) that was basically an a passive hub with 16 SSC's on one board with terminal blocks for 3 wire hookup? I mean, all the channels will be grouped. I know one weak link would be distance to first node but I wonder if this could be compensated for. Just was day dreaming while I tear down on the 60F day in January in Ohio ;D
-
The nodes stay extremely straight. I cannot compare to strapping method because I have not used that method (too many zip ties or tape for me). Never thought about the weight, it has not been an issue. The straps are pretty strong.
Not to high jack this thread Chris, but since i am stealling dpitts ideas any way. Do you have any picture of your tree setup?
-
Not trying to get off topic, but when you said you are storing your SSCs in a battery box and it seems to me we all agree the best way to string a mega tree is to use separate SSc's per string AND with all of the interest in SS mega trees... What if there was a mega tree controller (MTC) that was basically an a passive hub with 16 SSC's on one board with terminal blocks for 3 wire hookup? I mean, all the channels will be grouped. I know one weak link would be distance to first node but I wonder if this could be compensated for. Just was day dreaming while I tear down on the 60F day in January in Ohio ;D
Great Idea! Getting back on topic, you could just populate half of it for a half a mega tree, and all of it for a 360.
-
Not trying to get off topic, but when you said you are storing your SSCs in a battery box and it seems to me we all agree the best way to string a mega tree is to use separate SSc's per string AND with all of the interest in SS mega trees... What if there was a mega tree controller (MTC) that was basically an a passive hub with 16 SSC's on one board with terminal blocks for 3 wire hookup? I mean, all the channels will be grouped. I know one weak link would be distance to first node but I wonder if this could be compensated for. Just was day dreaming while I tear down on the 60F day in January in Ohio ;D
well, with a about 6ft maximum distance between ssc and first node, that would leave a almost 12ft in diameter mega tree. (more if you use null nodes)
-
The nodes stay extremely straight. I cannot compare to strapping method because I have not used that method (too many zip ties or tape for me). Never thought about the weight, it has not been an issue. The straps are pretty strong.
Not to high jack this thread Chris, but since i am stealling dpitts ideas any way. Do you have any picture of your tree setup?
thanks, that looks nicely done. there were suggestions of melting a hole in the plastic strapping, but in that case I think it would have weakened the material too much. this looks to have no such problem.
-
The nodes stay extremely straight. I cannot compare to strapping method because I have not used that method (too many zip ties or tape for me). Never thought about the weight, it has not been an issue. The straps are pretty strong.
Not to high jack this thread Chris, but since i am stealling dpitts ideas any way. Do you have any picture of your tree setup?
thanks, that looks nicely done. there were suggestions of melting a hole in the plastic strapping, but in that case I think it would have weakened the material too much. this looks to have no such problem.
As to hijacking the thread I am glad you did. This is a great idea and probably what I will do for 2013 (wife said she wants a SS megatree). +1 on the melting technique. Do tell!
-
it's not hijacking at all, everyone throw in your mega tree ideas!!!
-
it's not hijacking at all, everyone throw in your mega tree ideas!!!
Looking into brass grommets instead of the melting. Does anyone know if a #2 die (3/8") brass grommet is the right size to squeeze the nodes through? A brass grommet punch is about $9. The grommets are about $2-3 for 100. The only hassle is punching that many grommets may be daunting (a grommet press is about $150, and a bit of money for the hobby). I know that they melted a 3/8" hole in the above technique. However, I am certain there is an amount of play in the webbing material. Brass is a little less pliable.
Kurt
-
I burned the holes with a tooling pin. See picture below. When you pull the pin out the hole shrinks a little. The pliability of the material is a plus because the hole is slightly smaller then the node and creates a tight fit. I used a thinner material then a few friends in my area. They bought the material I linked to in previous post and their nodes fit real tight and did not need any hot glue. Dont forget to use a fan to blow the fumes away from you.
-
I did some more research on both the RGB lights and grommets.
The RGB lights are designed to be used with 12mm holes (for push through). 12mm = 0.47241 inches. The closest grommet is 1/2" (this would be slightly larger than needed, but it is considered the 12mm equivalent in the grommet world).
So, if you decide to use brass grommets, you will need a 1/2" grommet die kit with 1/2" grommets.
Kurt
-
The cheapest I think are at habor freight. You also may want to use some glue around the hole in the webbing to keep it from fraying.
-
2011 & 2012 I did full mega tree 24 strings of 60 on parachute cord with about 3.8" spacing (not measured).
bbing
For 2013 I am planning on a half mega tree with 24 strings of 80 with 3" measured spacing.
Now I was planning on using poly strapping and taping the nodes similar to what Walter Monkhouse did but this new idea of using poly webbing with holes melted from David (dpitts) is looking pretty good.
David did your friends have any problems with fraying?
Also where do you find a tooling pin and did the handle get hot when you were heating it up and melting the holes?
-
2011 & 2012 I did full mega tree 24 strings of 60 on parachute cord with about 3.8" spacing (not measured).
bbing
For 2013 I am planning on a half mega tree with 24 strings of 80 with 3" measured spacing.
Now I was planning on using poly strapping and taping the nodes similar to what Walter Monkhouse did but this new idea of using poly webbing with holes melted from David (dpitts) is looking pretty good.
David did your friends have any problems with fraying?
Also where do you find a tooling pin and did the handle get hot when you were heating it up and melting the holes?
First I take no credit for webbing method. I saw it on this board but the member used a punch and someone else mentioned we should burn them. So I burned them.
There was zero fraying. The pin I had left over from my "jig and fixture builder" days when i worked at Northrop Aircraft in the 90's. Any 3/8 metal pin will work, preferably a smooth hardened surface. The end should have a tapered rounded end. I held it with a pair of vise grips. I got it orange/red hot because I was able to burn more holes per heating. It took longer when I tried to burn without it being red hot.
-
Thank you for sharing. Looking to put together my first mega tree and love the idea.
-
I recomend looking for a drift ( punch or pin) they are hard and tapered they do not have a T handel though.
-
I recomend looking for a drift ( punch or pin) they are hard and tapered they do not have a T handel though.
I think that is a great idea. Harbor freight may be a good place to look. Also I never held it by the handle. I clamped vise grips onto the non handle part so a punch would be fine.
-
What if there was a mega tree controller (MTC) that was basically an a passive hub with 16 SSC's on one board with terminal blocks for 3 wire hookup? I mean, all the channels will be grouped.
The SanDevices E682 and the J1Sys ECG-P12R already do this, including pluggable terminal blocks. They are E1.31 devices and will run the TM1804 and TM1809 chips, plus others (5v and 12v). No need to reinvent.
They don't do PixelNet, but because of the way E1.31 Multicast works, they can coexist with the Etherdongle and Pixelnet.
-
Can the conductor run the ECG P12R?
-
Yeah, thought about the 682 for this as well as for a matrix sign. I am not comfortable enough to stray from the Lynx gear yet. That said, it would be half the price, easier to hookup, and I could use cheaper nodes and mega tree is not exactly an inexpensive element to add to your show...
I assume if one were to feed dmx to the 682 from a hub is all it takes. The j1sys gear is just over my head...
Getting back on topic. I am thinking more about the grommet idea. I wonder if just punching 3/8" holes is enough. A good punch is $10. I am just a bit freaked about burning 1,000 holes in a garage filled with my wooddorking stuff... ;D
-
The grommet hole will be too small for a 3/8" hole. You will need a 12mm hole for the RGB pixel to be pushed through (via their specifications). This means a 1/2" grommet as the closest thing to 12mm.
Kurt
-
The grommet hole will be too small for a 3/8" hole. You will need a 12mm hole for the RGB pixel to be pushed through (via their specifications). This means a 1/2" grommet as the closest thing to 12mm.
Kurt
Kurt,
Thank you for last post. It made me go out and measure diameter of pin. The burning pin was 1/2".
-
dpitts,
Glad you cleared that up. 3/8" seemed small. 1/2" makes much more sense.
Kurt
-
Thanks, Kurt. 1/2" it is. Punch is still the same cost. Ok, you guys think the burning critical to the strength? No fraying, etc. I am interested in making a jig that will ensure even spacing and I can't see how I could do that with burning the holes. Not opposed to burning afterword to seal the fibers.
-
The holes came out really close. I used to 2 - 2x4x10 screwed together the make a jig to hold the strap. I then marked hole locations on the board. The holes were put in within an 1/8". I mean nothing as close to the aircraft assembly lines I used to help contruct but this is not flying at over 1000 mph either.
-
Thanks, Kurt. 1/2" it is. Punch is still the same cost. Ok, you guys think the burning critical to the strength? No fraying, etc. I am interested in making a jig that will ensure even spacing and I can't see how I could do that with burning the holes. Not opposed to burning afterword to seal the fibers.
I think the burning (melting)is the key. Keeps it all from fraying, and makes a nice strong hole to insert the node into. I was going to run with this idea, too. I was thinking 2 pieces of 1" wide sheet metal, with 9/16 holes spaced about every 4". Clamp the webbing between them, and you've got a jig all set to melt a bunch of holes on 1 heating.
-
It would be an interesting test to see how bad the fraying could become with just a punch and a grommet put in place. My biggest issue is that I live in a townhouse (no garage or semi-enclosed outdoorsy place where fumes wouldn't matter too much) and I would prefer a non-plastic/nylon burning scenario. I think I am gonna test the grommet punch without burning and see how bad it is or can be potentially.
Kurt
-
I think a bigger issue with rgb trees ... Will become the ability to also do text. As you Said, the horizontal density is twice as good on a half tree, if you double up,in front ... Since normally the vertical spacing is much closer than the horizontal spacing. I really think most of the full isn't visible ... In my yard, it's deep .... So as you said, place it back a bit and nobody can see behind it. Plus these things are so directional. It limits what you can see, unlike a mini lights based tree.
-
I think a bigger issue with rgb trees ... Will become the ability to also do text. As you Said, the horizontal density is twice as good on a half tree, if you double up,in front ... Since normally the vertical spacing is much closer than the horizontal spacing. I really think most of the full isn't visible ... In my yard, it's deep .... So as you said, place it back a bit and nobody can see behind it. Plus these things are so directional. It limits what you can see, unlike a mini lights based tree.
I was amazed at how much of my half megatree is visible from behind. google map my address 4217 greenfich dr, 80126.
When people where on Goldcrest, they could see the megatree very bright and clear as you looked up kittiwake. This even though the tree is positioned nearly 180 degrees away from your vantage point.
As i mentioned before, the plastic sleeve of the flex strips glowed on its edges. I can stand behind my 20x120 tree and see the light animation for 18 of the 20 strands.
Remember my tree, flex strip is cabled tied to 1/2" metal emt, I will take a movie standing behind it and post it. My windows 7 box is now completely dead, i am using my windows 8 box. I luckily got the 500 gbytes of stuff onto a backup before it died. One issue is my Windows 8 box does not have firewire. My Sony TRV950 has the movies of my display. I ordered a firewire board from amazon, this week i should be able to capture video.