SSR4 and 120V Solinoid

[Palmdale Haunter]

I am trying to acquire some hardware that will work for Halloween applications and Christmas...

Has anyone used an SSR4 (DMX version) to acivate a solinoid to drive a pneumatic cylinder?

I have read on a varity of forums about "dimmers" that do not properly activate a solinoid.

Has anyone done this with the SSR4? I think these look like a very good piece of hardware and the price per channel is very good.

I don't want to go to the trouble building some if they will not work for this application.

[rrowan]

I would take a look at the MR16/DC controller

In the past I have used that to switch a relay. I did put two diodes in the line between the MR16 and the relay to reduce any risk of a spike when the relay would switch on/off

Rick R.

[peteandvanessa]

I did this successfully a few years back with a 120Volt D-Light AC16 controller

Now the AC16 isn't exactly the same as the SSR4 controller, but in principle it's similar.

All I did was to connect a 120 Volt solenoid to one of the AC16's outputs and triggered the solenoid when I wanted to activate the pneumatic cylinder for one of the props.

Another way I did it was with a security I/R light controller, and also with a stand alone prop controller, but essentially the Monster in a box and the monster in a trash can and the monster that jumps up in the videos below can be controlled by the AC16.



Now, the AC16 back when I did it, wasn't DMX capable, since then, I have upgraded the PIC chips in the AC16 so I can address them directly using DMX (in fact I'm using this AC16 in DMX mode this year for halloween).

Here's three of the props I made which was connected to a single channel of the AC16 controller, or the security light IR controller or the standalone controller:
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and here:
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and here:
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I got the control valves from this website:
(This link is for the Monster in a box valves and pneumatics)
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[tbone321]

You can use one if you want to but you need to configure the software light curve for full on so there is no dimming.  It would also be advisable to put a C7 or two across the coil inputs to eliminate triac damaging spikes when the realy shuts off.

[rm357]

You can, but I would like to encourage you to seek out a DC solution using something like the mr16, the holiday coro 3 channel led controller, or the 27 channel thing from aliexpress.

Why? The ssr4, lynx express, and other dimmers are expecting a resistive load, where relays and solenoids are inductive loads. This is getting a little technical, but basically with a resistive load, the current and voltage are in phase and when the triac turns off at the voltage zero crossing, no current is actually flowing. In an inductive load, the current lags behind the voltage. When the triac turns off at the voltage zero crossing, the current is still flowing out of the inductor and the electrons pile up at the junction- creating a voltage spike that the triac was not designed to withstand. On a DC circuit, you can put a diode there that will allow that current to keep flowing until the inductor is discharged. On an AC circuit, you cannot.

Adding lights as someone else mentioned does provide that path to discharge the inductor, so it is a good solution, but If you go that route, i would advise putting 2 lights so that when one burns out, it doesn't take the triac with it...

[peteandvanessa]

Adding lights as someone else mentioned does provide that path to discharge the inductor, so it is a good solution, but If you go that route, i would advise putting 2 lights so that when one burns out, it doesn't take the triac with it...

I must admit, when I connected the solenoid to my AC controller, I didn't have anything connected there other than the solenoid. I ran it like that for about 3 hours per night, everynight for four weeks. It was clicking on and off constantly as my songs cycled through. I didn't see any issues, but maybe I just got lucky.

[rm357]

Specifically which AC controller are you using?

I'll admit, I'm talking from a purely theoretical approach and it may work ok. Or it may burn up a triac. It's not likely to cause any other damage.

The ssr4 and lynx express are simple triac dimmer circuits designed for low power resistive loads. There are other designs which are more tolerant of inductive and capacitive loads. they are also more complex, take more parts, and cost more per channel...

[tbone321]

It also depends on the size of the relay as well.  Triacs do tend to leak a little and smaller relays don't have quite the kick potential of large relays or contactors and is those cases, the lower biuld up and leakage is enough to save the triac.

[peteandvanessa]

Specifically which AC controller are you using?

I'll admit, I'm talking from a purely theoretical approach and it may work ok. Or it may burn up a triac. It's not likely to cause any other damage.

The ssr4 and lynx express are simple triac dimmer circuits designed for low power resistive loads. There are other designs which are more tolerant of inductive and capacitive loads. they are also more complex, take more parts, and cost more per channel...

The AC controller I'm using is this one here:
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I also looked up the triacs and optos this is using versus the SSR4 controller

AC16
Triac - BTA16-700BWRG (16Amp 700v)
Opto - MOC3023

SSR4
Triac - BTA06-600SRG (6Amp 600v)
Opto - MOC3023

There doesn't seem to be that much difference between the two other than the lower current and lower voltage on the SSR4

The relay I was using is this one here:
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[gatorengineer]

I know this isn't that same thing at all, but it may help...then again it may be worthless. 

I saw someone was controlling lawn sprinkler valves with DMX.  Water is pneumatic, so maybe you can use them. 

Again, just another idea.  If it doesn't work, then trash it.

Good luck.

[tbone321]

Water is actually hydraulic but the valves have the same coils that the pneumatic ones have.

[Palmdale Haunter]

Wow thanks for all the replies!

I understand the difference between an inductive and resistive load (even though I am not an engineer).

I am trying to compare the SSR4 with some of the commercial dimmers that have a switch to use each channel as arelay instead if dimming. (see attached)

All said I think I will give this a go. I will add  a couple light bulbs (never a bad idea when your ghoul pops up from behind a tombstone...

I will use them for a couple mini trees (wish I had room for a mega) in the winter season...

Thanks all!!!!

[rm357]

The water valves that were done by someone's daughter on this site were 12vdc using an MR16.

[tbone321]

DC is easy because all you need to protect the device because as Rick said, all you need is a diode accross the terminals in reverse polarity to give a discharge path for the coils counter current.